Finalists Build

[lowpolyjoe]

Hey Everybody.

Recently picked up a kit from Meniscus to build Jim Holtz's 3way design, the Finalists.

http://speakerdesignworks.com/Finalists_1.html

I had already started a detailed build thread elsewhere before i found out about this forum, but I wanted to post some info here for anyone else who might pick up this kit.

I put some time lapse videos together that some may enjoy:

Rear panel
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=49xkXQ-SKM4

Baffle
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4i55alzr5nI

[lowpolyjoe]

Test fitting driver countersinks and through holes

[lowpolyjoe]

Rear panel pretty much complete

Baffle holes cut. I ran a chamfer on the rear of the baffle panel before assembly. Then i fully assembled the box. Then i veneered. Then i cut the countersinks and through holes. Worked out pretty well.

Driver dry fit

[lowpolyjoe]

I assembled the crossover on some 1/4" MDF.

Meniscus supplied a pic with their suggestion for mounting the near/far crossover switch and resistor. I followed it pretty close but did not create a second negative post as they did.

[lowpolyjoe]

A little before and after of my finish work.

The before picture has some dark spots that are still damp from a wipedown to get rid of the dust before applying the finish

Finish is Zinsser's clear shellac from home depot. Nice because it doesn't stink, but doesn't offer quite the same level of protection of other finishes.

[blue934]

what is the veneer? it looks funky. looking forward to your reviews, this design interest me.
David

[lowpolyjoe]

Hey David.

The dark colored veneer on most of the cabinet is Bubinga. I believe this selection is actually referred to as "Waterfall Bubinga". I saw a few builds using this species and just had to have it. Beautiful stuff. My selection was somewhat difficult to work with because it was a bit wavy. I treated it with veneer softener but i still ended up with some small ripples in the final product I used clamps, perhaps a vacuum press would have worked them out a bit flatter. I heard Bubinga is known for being somewhat difficult to work with so be advised.

The baffle is Karelian Birch. I thought it had a nice contrast against the darker Bubinga. I'm pretty happy with it.

[blue934]

interesting. great job so far.
D

[lowpolyjoe]

Finally done... not much time for listening impression yet except to discover some depth that i haven't heard with my other speaker setups. More comments to come as i do some critical listening

Some measurements with mid tunnel open and closed and resistor switch open and closed.

[lowpolyjoe]

Appologies for more or less a direct cut-and-paste of my post from another forum, but it sums up my experiences pretty well and anyone browsing the Meniscus kits may only check this forum as a reference.


I wired them up in my home theater setup, running off my Denon 3312. I had my Zaph 5.3 L/C/Rs previously and kept the center at first. After a little listening and hearing how full range the Finalists can run, i decided to switch off the center completely and run 2 channels up front. Sounds great. Dialog and imaging is much clearer than i expected. Funny that i got into this hobby to get cleaner dialog by buildling a nice center channel and now i'm back to 2 front channels and it sounds better than ever

One thing i should point out. I hadn't thought much about efficiency. I think the design is rated at about 84db. I had to turn the receiver up a bit higher to get these babies singing. I still didn't go above about -20db volume and they play plenty loud for me. Just something for other builders to keep in mind.


Last night i had some buddies over to watch the fights. We were commenting that it *really* sounded like there was a sub hidden somewhere. Obviously not a monster SPL sub, but a subtle, perfectly blended, bottom-fill sub. You hear notes that none of my previous speakers could produce and things are balanced perfectly. It's nice because i was hoping to run without a sub and now i probably will. You're not going to rattle the rafters but you get very wide coverage with this design without throwing an eyesore in the corner to do the grunt work.

Speaking of subs - i used to be a die hard basshead. I absolutely destroyed my ears in the car audio days. As such, i'm not the best person to relay the subtleties of a great set of speakers. I did some critical listening this afternoon. Maybe an hour or so before my wife got impatient waiting to watch tv. As much as I love this hobby, i've never gone out and collected a great selection of quality recordings. What I had to work with was some Beatles, Cranberries and Simon and Garfunkle.

The Finalists do great across the board. I already mentioned that they seem to dig very deep in supplying the lows. The midrange and highs are clear and balanced. Imaging is very convincing. I can't think of much more to say except that i'm happy with the sound

I was running them about a foot+ out from the back wall with the mid tunnel closed. I wanted to pull the plugs and listen open-back as a comparison but i couldn't get the plugs out They're very tight and i'm going to have to pull the mid drivers and push them out from the inside or risk breaking something if i yank away at the pulls. I sanded down the plugs a few times but they're still just a little too tight.

I'll report back as i get more listening in and if i can get some open-back experience under my belt.

Thanks again Jim for your design and continued support.

[Finleyville]

This could not have been timed any better. I will be starting a Finalists build soon myself. Your vids and pics are very helpful.

You have a small drill with a plunge attachment to it. What attachment is that? I really need to pick one of those up.

In the vids when you cut your woofer holes it looks like you re-plug the cutout then go over it again with the router. Were you cutting the countersinks then?

Your pic of the built crossover will be invaluable when I layout mine. Thanks. Where do you get your terminal strips? I really like those.

[lowpolyjoe]

You have a small drill with a plunge attachment to it. What attachment is that? I really need to pick one of those up.

In the vids when you cut your woofer holes it looks like you re-plug the cutout then go over it again with the router. Were you cutting the countersinks then?

Your pic of the built crossover will be invaluable when I layout mine. Thanks. Where do you get your terminal strips? I really like those.

Hey. Glad this thread helped you out. There is a little more to this build than a standard sealed or vented box given the PVC through tunnel and it's supports, but nothing crazy. I built the entire box and veneered it before cutting the through holes and that approach VASTLY complicated the build. It'd probably be easier if you cut the front and rear panel holes and countersinks before assembly, then veneer / paint later.

The drill with the stabalizing base is cool as hell. Unfortunately, it was a gift from a carpenter friend and i don't know where you can get one. I don't think it's really an attachment, i think it was part of the drill. It's a Craftsman, but it's got to be 20yrs old. Maybe there's a modern equivalent but i don't know. Some pics below with all the info i could find on it..

When i replugged the hole and hit it again with the router it was because when i first cut the countersink (before cutting the through hole) i must have had the wrong setting on my jasper jig and it was too small. I shimmed the cut-out back into position and made another pass to expand it to the right size. I'm super lucky i was accidentally too small and not too big or i would have been screwed.


As for the terminal strips - if you mean the little white screw-terminal things, those are from radio shack. There are two sizes at my local store, i think these were the larger ones. They come in a row of 10 or 15 connected and i snipped them into individual terminals for the crossover. nice to have screw connections instead for taking things in and out.

My countersink depths were slightly deeper than i would have liked in the end... you might want to measure your own depths and not use mine directly.

Good luck!

[mattsk8]

Nice job all the way around!! I love the veneer choices and the finish looks fantastic. Shellac isn't easy to work w/ either, looks like you nailed it

I'd love to hear a pair of those. I heard they sound as 'large' as the Statements!

[lowpolyjoe]

Thanks Matt. Statements were my first choice for this build but my livingroom setup will not allow for pulling the cabinets out far enough from the wall The Finalists have the sealed-mid-chamber option, which i have to use. I still kind of want to build the Statements at some point, just to hear that ribbon tweeter We'll see. The Finalists are VERY capable though. They offer more SPL than i personally need, but others who blast everything may disagree. I can't believe how low they play, usable very close to 20hz when EQ'ed when room gain kicks in!

For completeness i figured i'd post the distortion measures i did recently. Cranked my Denon 3312 *almost* all the way up. These are not super efficient speakers. I think my AVR is 125 or 150w/channel(?) and that gets me into 90's. PLENTY for me, but again, if you're into serious SPL you might want a hardcore amp to get to the theoretical 104dB limit. I measured a single channel at about 1M on tweeter axis. Mid tunnels were plugged. Speaker was in my normal listening location next to my flatscreen. Unfortunately that means some weird interactions with an 18" trap between the tv panel and the rear wall. Rear of the cabinet itself was about 1' from the wall.

First run was with no EQ

Second run was Auddyssey set to Music. This was kind of unscientific since Audyssey is supposed to flatten response at the listening location, not 1M, but i was curious. Low end does even out a bit with the EQ, but other parts of the curve suffer... measurements at calibration location (ie. on the couch) may have shown a flatter EQ'd curve in the mid range

OH.. and the legend (which Omnimic does not seem to supply for HD curves)

Red = 2nd harmonic
Purple = 3rd harmonic
Green = 4th harmonic
Light Blue = 5th harmonic
Dark Blue = 2nd-through-5th harmonic

[jeffantastic]

Beautiful build. The choice of veneers and finishes look great.